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At what price point do you expect a weight matched kendama? (POLL)

Discussion in 'The Sesh' started by goenKendama, Aug 23, 2018.

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At what price point do you expect a weight balanced kendama?

  1. All kendama from major manufacturers regardless of price

  2. $20-$30 and up

  3. $31-$50 and up

  4. $51-$60 and up

  5. $61-$80 and up

  6. $81-$100 and up

  7. more than $100

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. ShovelLovell

    ShovelLovell Honed Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2018
    Location:
    Alabama
    If you specify to KUSA they would’ve in all likelihood have got you a setup with nice lunar balance. Having a heavier sword isn’t at all a bad thing for someone that loves slingers. So I don’t think it’s fair to say it was poor quality control. And if you don’t specify your wishes for particular balance, they have no way of knowing. I understand your frustration though!
     
    Jun 13, 2019
  2. Dre_11

    Dre_11 Honed Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2019
    Location:
    West Covina, CA
    The shift i got with that balance was from a mystery box lol so i couldn’t leave a note, but i just figured that a shift would be more geared towards loons as compared to like a slim. It’s still a great dama and i jam it all the time haha just nitpicking because if someone is paying $75 expecting a lunar honed dama and they don’t get it then it’s kind of a disappointment when other companies do it w/o a note
     
    Jun 13, 2019
  3. htimSxelA

    htimSxelA Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2016
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Well, not every single kendama is made to be lunar honed, in fact, some players prefer a slinger-honed (butt-heavy) dama. So if you just assume a more expensive kendama is going to be more lunar honed, you might end up disappointed. While lunars are popular, many players prefer a dama that suits other play styles. Adding an order note is an option to try to get what you want.

    Also, its definitely possible to get a good dama (lunar honed, or whatever) for $30. But the thing about cheaper damas is it will generally be more of a gamble: one of them might be lunar honed, and the next might be 18 g off ken heavy, with a super heavy butt. Its just a matter of fact that any kendama business will not be able to put as much work into their cheaper products, the higher end stuff should be held to a higher QC.
     
    Jun 14, 2019
    Dre_11 likes this.
  4. Dre_11

    Dre_11 Honed Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2019
    Location:
    West Covina, CA
    Thanks for the replies! haha really opens my eyes because I thought lunar balance was like the most important thing because that’s all I hear in reviews. I myself am not too great at slingers so I guess I had a little tunnel vision. Nonetheless all damas deserve love! Destroy all damas!!
     
    Jun 14, 2019
    JHard502710 likes this.
  5. 96817dama

    96817dama Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2019
    Agreed. Although it may not be honed for lunars it'll be honed for slings, so in some other way it's still a honed dama. Try out slings on a butt heavy Ken and you'll most likely get addicted (like me) :)
     
    Jun 15, 2019
    JHard502710 likes this.
  6. JHard502710

    JHard502710 Honed Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Location:
    Louisville, Ky
    I’m garbage at slings(well multiple, any above maybe two but I even have a hard time with 2!) maybe most of my damas are Sarado heavy not butt heavy..? I’ll have to weigh some and see if I have a FatBottomGirl to start practicing slings more on
     
    Jun 15, 2019
    Dre_11 and 96817dama like this.
  7. 96817dama

    96817dama Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2019
    Dont worry! They get easy. I'm sure you have a sweets prime? Those are what unlocked my sling fever lol
     
    Jun 15, 2019
  8. Emil Apostol

    Emil Apostol DS Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2017
    Location:
    Philippines
    I expect it at 50 dollars and up, especially with "premium" kendamas from bigger companies. As wood weight and density is super variable, a company would need to have a large-scale production to have a better chance at weight matching kendamas on a consistent basis. Thus, I expect weight matching more from KROM, KUSA, Sweets, and other "big" brands.

    However, I do not expect weight matching when the kendama is a hand-turned 1/1 or something along those lines.
     
    Jun 15, 2019
  9. goenKendama

    goenKendama Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2016
    Location:
    Metro Manila, Philippines
    Funny, that's pretty much exactly when I would expect the best match. A skilled craftsman, particularly a kendama player, would put in the time to make the best they are able. It's not just about making a sale but showing what they can do and caring about the individual project. The bigger companies are relying on QC after the fact, after the parts are made because they're looking at things primarily as a business and the physical manufacturers (workers) need to produce efficiently in volume. In the bigger operations one individual isn't responsible for the entire kendama creation so only has control over a specific area or part. Someone who hand-turns has total control from selecting the wood on through to completion. I would be surprised if a true craftsman would let something substandard out the door if they had any choice in the matter.

    If you haven't already you might go check out the thread What is meant by "hand-turned" when it comes to kendama.
     
    Jun 15, 2019
  10. ShovelLovell

    ShovelLovell Honed Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2018
    Location:
    Alabama
    Totally get what you mean man! I’ve gotten a craft shift that had pretty awful lunar balance. But it shredssss slings. And with the right amount of effort you can still pull of some nice lunar tricks. :)
     
    Jun 15, 2019
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  11. htimSxelA

    htimSxelA Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2016
    Location:
    Vancouver
    I generally agree- with a handturned dama you have the maximum hands-on time with the piece to make sure it is honed.

    However, there are caveats. If someone asked me to handturn a ken and tama, out of some rare species of wood, then I generally would not guarantee weight matching up front. I'd do my best to estimate the weights of the final pieces based on the starting materials, but ultimately, I can't be sitting there turning a whole bunch of rare-wood kens/tamas until I get two that match within 5 grams (or whatever the desired match was).
    For a situation like that, I'd just make it clear up front what my guesstimate of final weight ranges would be, and explain there are no guarantees. If the customer wanted a super-close weight match or bust, I'd offer the option of machine-made tamas, or just not take the job on.

    In the best cases, I can guesstimate weights quite well, but wood is variable and sometimes weird things happen, so its very tough to be right all of the time.
     
    Jun 16, 2019
  12. goenKendama

    goenKendama Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2016
    Location:
    Metro Manila, Philippines
    Degrees of acceptability to be sure but I was thinking of playable rather than collectible kendama (though I understand there are some who might play something way outside the norm). I wouldn't expect that the USD 10,000 Snakewood Iwata kendama I saw at KWC last year to be weight matched. Finding sufficiently large enough chunks of wood would be part of the limitations there. I'd never play it but I would expect the fit and finish to be dead on. I understand there are limitations either monetary or physical but most know that going in and as you mention you'd explain the limits upfront. I'd still pretty much always expect the best products from a craftsman; to be something special.

    It's the same thing I expect from custom knife makers and most, like you, would tell you what's what up front. In cases where they have customers who can afford it they will often take on work they'd otherwise not with the customer understanding that there would be additional expenses or time required.
     
    Jun 17, 2019
    htimSxelA likes this.
  13. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos n00b

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Location:
    Athens
    Not about weight as for the tama match you can restring in another ken and your fine so as is the egg shape is annoying taps out when doing a trick . I find myself worrying about the serado and the ken weight match i want the serado at least 2 gramms heavier than the Ken some come just drilled for beauty and not for front balance. Annoying enough
     
    Jun 18, 2019
  14. jimgrude

    jimgrude n00b

    Joined:
    May 21, 2019
    Location:
    Tokyo
    Weight is so important that I think every serious brand should feel an obligation to pay attention to it. I really like the system Kenholix uses, with three different weight categories for each model. The tama to ken weight ratio is also guaranteed to be within 3 grams.
     
    Jun 18, 2019
    Dantama likes this.