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KROM x No Jumper? Yay? Or Nay?

Discussion in 'The Sesh' started by Kyle Palado, May 28, 2018.

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Yay or nay?

  1. Yay

  2. Nay

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  1. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    Sexual assault claims towards minors from what i found on his wiki. Just google adam22 and you’ll find what makes many people in this community wary of his presence.
    But again, just claims and accusations
     
    Aug 1, 2019
  2. Ricky Røge

    Ricky Røge Slayer

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    Hahaha that is so not why you got banned, but just keep telling yourself that
     
    Aug 1, 2019
    KeeganS likes this.
  3. htimSxelA

    htimSxelA Moderator Staff Member

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    Honestly, lets leave what happens in the FKC, in the FKC. That place seems to breed animosity
     
    Aug 1, 2019
    slothymane, Qonnor and KeeganS like this.
  4. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    In an effort to steer this back onto topic, how would you guys feel seeing all these big name social media personas, artists, content creators that adam22 has introduced to kendama at dama events? Especially those in his own close circle. What if they have a similar reputation as adam22 (accusations and here-say, nothing confirmed) but without the following that he has? Would there be as much offensive behavior from the community towards them or not as much?
    A post previous to this showed him with Jake Paul landing his first spike, what about Logan Paul being introduced and getting into kendama after his controversial behavior in Japan (home to kendama) earlier this year?
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2019
    Aug 1, 2019
  5. Ricky Røge

    Ricky Røge Slayer

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    I think there is some what of a difference between accusations and some Thing Like what logan Paul did. In logans case its not an accusation, there os plenty of proof
     
    Aug 2, 2019
  6. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    Exactly. Will Logan Paul have as much contention if he joined the kendama community as adam22 does due to having proof as opposed to just accusations? Or will he be see more acceptance since he doesnt have as bad a rep/isnt seen as bad a role model when compared to adam22?
     
    Aug 2, 2019
  7. Qonnor

    Qonnor Slayer

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    Okay so here's how I see it in economic terms. Kendama in the sense of it as an object and the people it attracts as well as the kind of community it creates is much closer to a sport like skateboarding than it is anything else. Compared to skating, however, the kendama community is tiny. In every insular community like this, there is a limited number of dollars that will be spent within the community per year. Since kendama is small comparatively, the number of dollars that can be expected to be spent annually in our community is smaller than what you would see in skateboarding.

    In order for kendama (or any sport) to stay healthy and even grow, people need to make kendamas, produce media, take kendama into new communities, host jams, host comps, etc. As anyone who has ever had a job and paid rent knows, the above things get exponentially harder to do when you have limited time to invest in them. As such, the aforementioned number of dollars spent in this community annually have to be able to sustain X number of people doing this work full time. Fewer people doing this work means fewer jams, fewer drops, fewer comps, etc. In skateboarding, their economic intake is way larger annually. This means they can sustain a ton more people working full time on the above things. This helps skateboarding grow and exponentially and also ensures that their community can accept a lot more economic risk in terms of how spread out the market is and how saturated it can get.

    Companies like KUSA, Sweets, Terra, DWI, KROM, SOL, GT etc have shown that for each dollar invested in them, they return all of the above things in the form of new shapes and drops, hosting jams, sponsoring pros, and sending them all over the world etc. These things are literally vital to the health of kendama. Remember that limited amount of money I mentioned earlier? The more companies that money is spread between, the less money each company gets. If each company is getting less money, that means it can sustain fewer people doing the work we know we need in order for Kendama to keep growing. Since kendama is small, even a minor change in the overall distribution of funds across companies can have a huge and immediate impact on how many people that company can employ and what they can sponsor in the community. In our case, over saturation of our market is very very bad. Didn't sweets recently have to cut waaaay back on their painting staff, for example?

    In theory, Adam22 spreading kendama and bringing new people into the fold could increase the dollars spent on kendama annually right? BUT. How many people buy a NJK, jam it, and then end up picking up a Sweets or a KUSA dama next? Even worse, how many people who started playing dama before NJK are now spending their money on NJK kendamas? For a lot of us, we only have a certain amount of money to spend on damas in a set period of time, so $40 to NJK is literally $40 not spent somewhere else. I do not believe that the number of dollars Adam22 brings into the collective kendama market comes anywhere close to surpassing the potential economic damage NJK could have on the companies who are actually good for the health of kendama. NJK is saturating the market while also not delivering any of the things that major kendama companies do to spread the game.

    As kendama players and community members with a vested interest in the health of our game, it is essential that we spend our money ethically. I know that when I spend $40 on a DWI pro mod, I can expect to see DWI players competing in KWC, DWI prizes at my local jams, AND that a certain percentage of that purchase is going directly to the pro player. The same goes for pretty much every other company I listed except NJK.

    Each dollar spent on a NJK literally hurts the companies and pros we know and love. I'm hyped on famous people picking up kendama. Like let's spread the visibility of this game and get as many people on board as we possibly can! BUT. what's happening here is so far from that. Adam22 is like a shitty B list celebrity with too much time and money who is acting tremendously irresponsibly in regards to this community. Kendama is a healthy game with a ton of potential to grow, but people with huge followings just trying to make a buck off kendama without investing any of that money back into the community could literally destroy the infrastructure of kendama in the west. This is why I talk so much shit on Adam22.
     
    Aug 2, 2019
    Raider_Aegis, halidan, LA111 and 3 others like this.
  8. Qonnor

    Qonnor Slayer

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    So I literally couldn't care less if Logan Paul started jamming dama on his instagram. But if he starts a "company" like NJK I'm going to lose my fucking mind straight up.
     
    Aug 2, 2019
    KirStylez, Emil Apostol and KeeganS like this.
  9. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    Preach (this and your above reply)
     
    Aug 2, 2019
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  10. Emil Apostol

    Emil Apostol DS Legend

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    If I may open a line of inquiry, what happened to the relationship between Adam22 and Sweets (and KROM to a lesser extent)? They used to be super tight, with Sweets Kendamas being sold in OnSomeShit and appearing at NoJumper-organized parties.

    Sure, NoJumper kendama happened, but the relationship just grew cold all of a sudden.
     
    Aug 2, 2019
  11. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    That might be a question that only those close to those two companies can answer
     
    Aug 2, 2019
  12. Qonnor

    Qonnor Slayer

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    My assumption is that before NJK was a thing, sweets and krom were looking at Adam22 as a way to sell their product. Seems like as soon as Adam22 realized he could just order damas cheap from China and sell them as his own product he stopped giving a shit about existing dama brands.

    We already know that Sweets has no problems courting retailers since they got damas into Target of all places. I'd be willing to bet Adam just ghosted them.
     
    Aug 2, 2019
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  13. Qonnor

    Qonnor Slayer

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    Bumping to say wtf is going on with NJK stealing people's designs?
     
    Dec 26, 2019
  14. KirStylez

    KirStylez Member

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    Rep of Adam22 and No Jumper aside, I bet if Adam22 was jamming a JKA dama first, he wouldn’t bother even perusing kendama any further cause as you may know those OG TK16 and Ozora paint were icy AF!
     
    Dec 29, 2019
    Emil Apostol likes this.
  15. Emil Apostol

    Emil Apostol DS Legend

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    JKA Kendamas either make or break your love for Kendama if you start on one. I started on an Icy af Red Ozora and it was quite challenging, but it's made every other kendama after that a joy to play.
     
    Dec 29, 2019
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  16. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    I don't think that'd be the case. When I saw him at NAKO this last year he didnt really mess around with too many tricks where sticky paint made it easier.
     
    Dec 29, 2019
  17. goenKendama

    goenKendama Moderator Staff Member

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    It seems a bit unlikely that is the case with all people who start with a JKA kendama. There might be a few who don't have the patience and self-discipline to continue but there are many others who started playing JKA dama and continue to do so regularly.

    Perhaps you give him too little credit for for his interest in kendama or its ability to woo new players regardless of paint. Sticky paint availability is a blip on the kendama timeline and people have played and enjoyed it for a hundred years (longer if you count the predecessors).
     
    Dec 29, 2019
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  18. KirStylez

    KirStylez Member

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    Perhaps I am being judgmental on the situation, but I just saw his YouTube tutorial online and he goes off suggesting Kendama brands (aside from No Jumper) like Krom, Sweets, Sol, and GT. No KUSA no Terra. He then says don’t get a crappy Kendama which made me wonder if he even played a JKA and if he did, is he suggesting that JKAs are crappy because of the small cups and the icy paint? That got me riled because I played JKAs which then steered my curiosity to play a dama with tacky paint that being my OG KUSA Choral Turquoise kaizen half split and not to toot my own horn, but my skills evolved from there because I played with JKAs first (my marine blue Ozora and dark blue Shinfuji). Then again maybe I was just fan-girling over KUSA and Terra because those are my favorite brands.
     
    Dec 30, 2019
  19. KirStylez

    KirStylez Member

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    That just goes back to my point. Would he have spent as much time and investment in the Kendama community and influence other players to Kendama had he been introduced to a JKA kendama first?
     
    Dec 30, 2019
  20. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    I dont think his interest would change if that’s what he started with when he first did so however long ago. Like every other player here in the US, he would have eventually found Sweets, Krom, and/or KUSA as they’re the largest names in kendama all over the world. Like @goenKendama says, i too believe you give him too little credit for his interest in kendama despite everyone’s vocal opinions of how he runs his kendama business within the community, when I saw him at NAKO, it was rare to see him not jamming kendama throughout the weekend just like everyone else in attendance.
    I dont think it’d matter in the end what kendama he would have started with if he like many other adults who first discover it became enamored with the challenge of it as opposed to having a kendama that makes it ‘easier’
    (Keep in mind I’m not fighting for/against him, just giving an objective view)

    and I think you might be taking the notion of what he thinks are crappy kendamas too personally maybe? I havent seen this tutorial video myself but if he doesn’t mention a brand that he thinks people should get it doesnt automatically mean that he thinks they’re ‘crap’. There is a somewhat unanimous opinion within the kendama community of what the ‘crappy’ kendamas are but they are just that, opinions. Just because one person doesn’t like, play, or even just suggest one doesn’t lessen their value. It’s like when people in FKC keep asking, “What kendama should I buy?” there will always be people who say ‘Sweets’ and others who say ‘KUSA’ or ‘Krom’ or whatever brand they’re liking at the moment. Doesn’t mean that the other brands not mentioned are crap just because they werent suggested unless they outright say, “dont buy from x-compay.”
    Maybe he didnt suggest KUSA or Terra because he has no experience so no real opinion to go off of about them? Terra is a bit understandable as they’re up in Canada and typically go for big $$$ especially their handturned damas and KUSA doesn’t typically market themselves to/with someone the same way Sweets does (from what i remember it’s been Krom and Sweets who both have had any interaction with Adam and NoJumper).
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2019
    Dec 30, 2019